Episode #48 - Lilah Raptopoulos, FT Weekend
Hanna (02:27)
Hi, Lilah. So great to see you.
Michael (02:30)
Thank you for joining us today.
Lilah (02:32)
Hi Hanna and Michael! Thank you for having me. It's a real privilege.
Michael (02:34)
The privileges is ours. How did you get into journalism and what do you like most about being a writer?
Lilah (02:42)
I just want to say, I've really been enjoying the show. It's just like a nice opportunity for me to think about the relationship I have with story ideas and pitches and, um, and your industry.
So thank you. Um, I always loved journalism. I was thinking about this recently and sort of middle school, high school, college, I was always on my school newspaper, running my school newspaper. And, um, I think I love most the curiosity that you're always learning something new, that you're trying to figure out what matters about it. You're trying to kind of figure out the puzzle of how to share that story in a way that interests others, as much as it interests you. Um, and then the platform, you have to share stories that matter with people who will then be thinking about it are able to take action off of it, um, is kind of an honor.
It's like, that comes along with it and it feels like a responsibility to that I like.
Hanna (03:37)
For our listeners. Can you tell us about the Financial Times? So how has it evolved, especially during the pandemic?
Lilah (03:46)
Sure. Um, so the Financial Times focuses on business and economic affairs, but it's also a generalist news source and has incredible politics reporting and a really vibrant award-winning life and arts section called FT Weekend, which is where I spend most of my time, because it's so global and full of so many brilliant people. It's main hub is in London, but our audience is all over the world. We have about 700 journalists all over the world and about 40 countries.
Michael (04:16)
What would you say makes an FT story, an FT story, and what sets the publication apart from other business outlets?
Lilah (04:24)
Because it's so global, our reporting is often connecting the dots, big picture, and it's motivated by a bigger question. It's the why, right. That a lot of, sort of like the why, how does it fit into the world that we're living in now? How does it fit into the politics? How does it fit into the culture that it's in? Sort of what's the big arc?
Hanna (04:44)
You started at the Financial Times in 2016. So how did you land your job?
Lilah (04:52)
Um, it was as many things as a combination of, uh, luck and timing and hard work. I was living in London. I was working with The Guardian.
I was also freelancing about the human side of the financial crisis, um in Greece. I was going back and forth to Greece in 2015, the banks were all closed and it was a real nightmare there and I have family there and I know it well. So, um, I was doing that and I was very interested in community journalism and using readers to help reporting and telling sort of, um, human stories behind the news.
And I joined the FT as a community editor, um, as sort of doing that work of involving our readers in the reporting that we were doing and building community around our journalism. Um, and my career has taken on a number of new adventures since then.
Michael (05:46)
Speaking of new adventures, you are the US head of Audience Engagement. What exactly does that role entail?
Lilah (05:54)
My job is sort of split right now between a few things. The one that's probably most relevant is hosting the FT Weekend podcast, which we can talk more about. Um, but the US head of Audience Engagement is I'm running a small team of editors that run our social media accounts and think strategically about how to grow our readership and build engagement in the US from an editorial point of view.
So, I actually do think a lot about what you probably think a lot about Hanna, which is how to angle a story to be most interesting to readers. What makes an audience click and want to read something or engage with it, how to build community around something. And I bring that knowledge into the podcast too.
Michael (06:33)
Your point of view, you cover culture for the most part. And given the FT’S focus on finance and business, how is that reflected in what you're writing about?
Lilah (06:43)
So, after the weekend is both the place where there's space for a long form journalism. So takes our news pages and expands, often tells the human stories behind them.
And it also is a place for lifestyle journalism, for food and restaurants and wine and film and books and architecture and art. I think of it as sort of the lean back activity like FT’s, like your weekday morning coffee and weekend is like your Saturday flat white with your croissant that you kind of like, it's sort of the pleasure activity.
Hanna (07:16)
What is it like to cover US news for a UK based publication with a global audience?
Lilah (07:25)
Um, it's interesting. It's a different lens. It's a cool lens. I'm always looking for a story that will resonate globally, uh, that will fit into those bigger questions that people may be thinking about. So, if you're reading from Brussels and I'm writing about New York, um, it has to matter to you too.
So it's less, even if it is about a restaurant. It can't just be about that restaurant opening, um, because the audience is so global, it has to fit into some bigger, bigger story or question or, or trend.
Hanna (08:04)
So it's like a local activation with a global perspective.
Lilah (08:08)
I love that. Yeah!
Hanna (08:10)
Well thank you!
Michael (08:13)
So what, why don't we drill down into that thought a little bit more. Can you walk us through the whole process? Uh, taking a story idea from concept through execution from start to finish.
Lilah (08:25)
So, because we're global, I rarely do sort of roundups or reviews as such. Um, and because I cover the gamut of culture, which is so broad, I'm looking for something so often that will help answer a question or make sense of things or touch on your sense of wonder.
So, I try not to approach a story straight on, so I'll use an example if that's okay.
Uh, so Hanna, I met you actually through a magazine cover that I wrote about chefs coming out of the pandemic. With that piece, um, we made a podcast episode off of it as well, but it started with the question that my editor and I had, which was that chefs went through these and restaurateurs went through these existential questions like all of us did during the pandemic.
Um, maybe even more so because they were feeding hungry New Yorkers. They had to lay off so many people. Um, so we wanted to know how it changed them. And what was I seeing in New York? What were the ways they were grappling with this question of how to be good? It's not only about Michelin stars now.
What does it mean to do good? What did they feel was their responsibility? How did they choose? Um, so we had those questions. I had those questions and then I needed to start following some chefs.
I started with the people I knew there was a neighborhood restaurant, Olmsted, and a chef there, Greg Backstrom. I had been passing his restaurant through the pandemic and seeing in the window and it was interesting to me. So I knew I wanted to talk to him. Obviously, Daniel Humm, he had the buzziest decision for 11 Madison Park to go vegan, obviously the most well-known. So I knew I wanted to speak with him.
I wrote a PR person I had worked with before she had written to me with an idea, it didn't quite work. And I said, I was doing this and if she had any thoughts, I knew that, um, it would have been very easy. In any industry to end up accidentally with like a story with four white men. And, uh, and this industry has so much more than that.
And so they put me in touch with you, Hanna, um, and Overthrow Hospitality. And, uh, sort of the vegan little mini empire that, uh, they were creating in the East Village, which was really interesting. The pitch has really great. Um, that became part of the story. And then there was another group called Migrant Kitchen. I think I had read about them in Eater. I followed them on Instagram.
So these are the sorts of things that I, if this helps you, the sorts of ways that, um, things. me when I'm trying to figure out stories. Um, and, uh, and so I reached out to them too. So from a story point of view, I like not having people on in a traditional way. It would have been easy maybe to go to Daniel Humm and have him tell me the story of his career or the story of 11 Madison Park.
And the goal here was that we were all trying to answer this bigger question together. And so in that exercise, you end up learning just as much about who these people are and what matters to them. But also it means, they go off script a little bit more. They tell you something new. It's sort of, uh, interesting for them. It's interesting for you. And it makes for a nice story
Hanna (11:21)
Your story not only included the world famous chef, Daniel Humm, but also, you know, the very unknown chefs like Chef Shenarri from Cadence and along with Ravi. So it was a beautiful piece. And thanks again for spotlighting all various of people from their career and, um, their achievements. So thank you.
Lilah (11:43)
Yeah, that meant a lot to me. So thank you. I appreciate that.
Hanna (11:46)
All right. So, let's move on to something that we all love. Podcasting! So, you started co-hosting the FT’s Culture Call podcast in 2019. And now you are the solo host of FT Weekend.
Lilah (12:07)
Yes.
Hanna (12:08)
So why was the inspiration for launching the podcast?
Lilah (12:12)
Sure. So the show, yeah, it was previously called Culture Call and we interviewed mostly big names in culture. It was a very pretty straightforward interview show, people that we thought were pushing culture forward. But we relaunched in September as FTW, um, to really be the flagship show, kind of a magazine style audio show.
It brings everything unique and invigorating about the weekend pages to your ears. So finding the stories for audio is an interesting exercise, but it's weekly, every Saturday. And we usually have about three segments a week and it's amazing. I both take stories my colleagues have written on and have them on and make it sound rich.
Um, I do original stories with my team about cultural topics, but we're really looking to take listeners on a trip, like teach them something new, make them think, consider how they lived their lives. That sort of thing.
Michael (13:05)
You know, you did a fascinating interview with Malcolm Gladwell and he explains how podcasting has a, what he called, a built-in institutional pressure to maintain an open mind. And it's an emotional medium. Does that resonate with you?
Lilah (13:21)
It really does. Um, and it's interesting because you can't hide it really. I mean, you can edit, but when you're in a conversation with somebody, you can sort of, you're within the journey with them, you have to respond. There's sort of this idea that, um, news has to be objective.
Um, and yes, in many ways it does, but also everything is subjective even, even, um, quotes you choose. Um, or the people you choose to speak to like gives any piece of a level of subjectivity. So, there's some honesty in audio.
Hanna (13:53)
In every episode, you feel like you're there with them. And I think that’s what I love so much about podcasting is that it's the real deal. It's real.
Lilah (14:01)
Yeah. And actually it reminds me of, you know, we were talking, I know that you talk a lot in your show about where you get your ideas and how journalists, and actually, although I get my ideas in a lot of the ways that the other journalists have suggested on Instagram and through friends and in conversations and in other interviews and in PR pitches, I read my PR pitches, It's great. It often sparks ideas.
I do also get them from listeners because listeners have developed a relationship with me and feel like we're in conversation. So, they'll often write me on Instagram or on Twitter or on email to say, mostly on Instagram to say, I've been thinking about this a lot. Is that something that you're seeing? And that's really great, so it's an ecosystem where we're all part of this thing together, which is nice.
Hanna (14:57)
Speaking of the financial times, content, what is their relationship between what goes into print versus. The podcast, I mean, does that content overlap at all?
Lilah (15:09)
Yeah, it often overlaps. I mean, we want to be the sort of a showcase for FT Weekend, so that involves bringing on our journalists. So that means that we're always thinking about what stories are coming up. We work in a relatively long timeframe, but we're thinking about the stories that are coming up, that we have reporters that are collecting audio often from and that would be transportive to listeners or would be interesting, or has an audio element to it and sort of would feel like either like a deep conversation or a journey. And then we also do our own reporting.
So I can give you an example, um, with, uh, a recent segment we did with Danny Meyer. Um, I was speaking with a publicist at I think Resy, who had invited me to a few events and they were openings or one-offs, and they just didn't really make sense for the podcast, um, or for a piece.
But I told her, look, I'm looking for something different. And a few things I'm always looking for. I can sort of tell you as well, is, um, interviews with big names that are really interesting people who are pushing culture forward, but also that's not it, right? It's like also interesting angles on things, excursions we could do. Dramatic stories about the arts and culture and luxury and food and travel and restaurants that we can tell. Kind of explorations. And she came back to me to say, okay, well, we're doing this campaign where we're having top chefs and restaurateurs pair up with their favorite classic restaurants.
If that sparks any ideas, she sent me a list. Um, and one of the people on the list was Danny Meyer and he had chosen Sparks Steak House and we thought, oh, that could be cool. You know, like what a Danny Meyer who's known for being ahead of the curve, learn about hospitality from one of the old-school restaurants in New York that like really never changes that probably hasn't changed in decades.
Michael (17:02)
Which is the whole point.
Lilah (17:03)
Right. Which is the whole point. Exactly. So we went to lunch with him and we recorded that lunch and, um, I think it was, uh, it was, it was fun for him. It was fun for us. It made for good audio. It was sort of on a slant. So. He said a lot about hospitality that I hadn't heard in other interviews that I think happened through the fact that we were telling you through this other story.
Michael (17:25)
Well, I have to say, we always learn something from Danny. We were very lucky that we've known him going on 20 years. We were privileged to help him launch two bars in a restaurant in New York and Chicago. And we always take away something from an interaction with him. And, you know, in your piece, we absolutely loved his observation that his favorite restaurant is the one that loves him the most. With restaurants really being in the business of supplying invisible hugs, that's poetry and so profound. And it really cuts through a lot of the noise and really gets at the heart, gets at the essence.
Lilah (18:03)
Yeah.
Hanna (18:04)
It's just so inspiring. We love you Danny!
Michael (18:07)
And also him saying that it's much easier to start a restaurant from scratch than to reopen, you know a real beloved institution was very Frank and very revealing. So were there any other surprises that came out of that interview?
Lilah (18:24)
Yeah, that was interesting. That point when he said that he actually said like, oh, I hadn't thought about that until just now, but it is harder to open a beloved restaurant, like Gramercy Tavern than to open, to sort of reopened it because people expect something.
And if it's turned over, if the staff has turned over significantly, it's a little harder to promise. I also thought it was interesting, the idea that like, It was sort of unscientific math that there's maybe, say there's 10 restaurants that a person goes to. Of have 10 restaurants, like four of them are ones that you go to regularly or often, or are your regulars.
And then six of them are new and you really want to be as a restaurant, in those four. Like you want to be one of the favorites. Um, yeah, but I really like, because my work it's interesting. I was thinking about this, like, I'm kind of a culture generalist, you know? Um, I don't have a hyper-specific beat.
I'm not a restaurant critic. You have some really incredible guests that have very specific, um, uh, like very, uh, deep knowledge into, in, um, specific parts of the hospitality industry, but I do find myself going back over and over to hospitality. I feel like I over index there in the stuff that I'm writing and putting on a show and that interests me.
And I think it's partially because it's just like a fascinating place. It's a very friendly place, very human industry. The people in it are really hustling. It's really hard work, but I think it's sort of like people are into it because like Danny Meyer put it like everyone wants to feel loved and, and, and this industry is creating an environment for people to feel good in.
And, you know, everybody touches it like multiple times a day. It's ubiquitous hospitality, so people want to understand it. So it's been a fun thing to cover.
Michael (20:13)
So, for our listeners, in the coming months, what types of stories are you going to be working on both for print and online?
Lilah (20:20)
In the new year, I feel like it will be clear how things have changed in a maybe a little, slightly more permanent way that we like to dig into, um, I'm interested in how the luxury world has changed over the years and what people want from luxury right now and how that's been appended or has evolved.
I'm interested also in where the foods and traditions that we love now, and that have become hot now sort of came from. For example, spirits, like rum, were invented really by enslaved people in the Caribbean who found that you could ferment molasses into alcohol. Um, and a lot of early years of cocktail making comes from that experimentation and that history has gotten washed away and you know, it's being revisited now. I’m nterested in how that new history is affecting what we do.
We just interviewed, um, Shannon Mustipher, who's the first African American bartender to publish a cocktail book in more than a century. Um, we were talking with her about that and that's something that I'm, I'm curious about expanding our coverage on, and then also like nightlife, how that's changed and is changing.
Um, and I'm always looking for places and experiences and food and restaurants and bars that are exciting and are doing something on a tilt.
Hanna (21:37)
2021 was like sort of a survival mode for everyone. Everyone was like, let's get through this, let us survive. But then 2022, I feel like it's going to be the year of the discovery.
You know, I think the people are going to be more settled in and, and it's more like a journey to exploring that things that we haven't done for the last two years. So I definitely see your interest in those topics going to be very interesting to a lot of audience, but also a lot of consumers out there.
Lilah (22:09)
Yeah. It's going to be an exciting year.
Hanna (22:11)
For our listeners around the globe, uh, from the hospitality and travel industry full want to pitch their stories to you. What are the three things that they should keep in mind?
Lilah (22:26)
Okay. One would be, just understand what we're doing. I mean, I love when people have thought about the work that I do, have listened to the show, have a sense of what it does, have read my writing a little bit and our tailoring, of course. You've talked about that before. When I share with people who are pitching me what I'm looking for and they come back with an idea that fits that's also awesome. If you really believe in it, I want to feel that. You can kind of tell the difference in a pitch.
Sometimes when I'm talking with someone, there is an opening and they're supposed to pitch me, but then there's this other thing that they really think is great or they really are excited about. I want to hear that thing, the other thing. Persistence really helps. If I show interest in an idea, but we don't come back to you, it's just because we get a lot of pitches or I'm also on deadline or trying to put the show out. So, kind of make it easy for me to bring the idea forward. We're working on long timeframes, so you can be ambitious with your pitch, but like, if we think of an idea together that could really work, like, you know, keep up, hold, you know, respond, you know, keep it moving.
And then the last thing is just that, like, you will never know, right? Like someone pitching will never know what thread is going to interest me in a story. Sometimes people pitch me one thing and there's something in it that I want to follow instead. So, like a chef's cookbook is coming out. That's cool. I'm not in the business of reviewing cookbooks, but that chef just spent months on the US Mexico border and found something there that surprised them.
I might have them on to talk about that. So, maybe like, be clear about the themes that the person or the thing you're pitching fits into, what the bigger story could be, how it fits into culture now, or why it decidedly doesn't and why that's interesting or how you tell your friend, you know, this is awesome because X over dinner, that's the sort of thing. That really works for me.
Michael (24:24)
So we call our podcast Hospitality Forward because we believe that our industry will come back stronger than ever. So what organization or person have you recently seen innovating and moving the hospitality and travel industry forward?
Lilah (24:39)
So many that are doing such outstanding work. Um, first of all, there's big names. Like, I mean, I, I. I interviewed Alice Waters, who at this stage in her career, like really believes in her mission to bring healthy meals to every public school student in America. You know, she's very sweet and I think people expect her to just be very sweet, but she's also very determined as almost a lobbyist in fulfilling that mission, which I found really interesting.
And, um, also to people like Shannon Mustipher, to people like Migrant Kitchen, people like Ravi DeRossi at Overthrow, I'm really interested in how the industry seems to be asking themselves, you know, what am I doing that's greater than just having a business that's doing well?
Um, and everyone answers that different way. You know, am I trying to give my staff health insurance? Am I trying to serve lesser? No meat. Am I trying to give people a platform who are amazing, but the system has worked against them. It's a hard business. The hospitality industry, it's a hard business. I mean, they don't have to be taking these questions seriously.
Um, but they are. And, uh, and that's really inspiring.
Michael (25:49)
On a lighter note, what's your favorite drink?
Hanna (25:51)
Yes! Let’s talk about cocktails.
Michael (25:52)
And if you could choose two people, one contemporary and one historic, who would you share this drink with and why?
Lilah (24:39)
Oh my gosh, this is a very, very hard question. It's a light fun question, but it's also, I'm going to, I'm having an existential crisis thinking of an answer to this. Okay. So, um, I really love bitter cocktails. I will say. Um, it's hard for me to choose a favorite. I really love Negroni's but I have seen a lot of, um, beet cocktails on menus recently. I had like three in the past month and they're great. They're really good.
Michael (26:25)
They are great.
Hanna (26:24)
Right. They make you feel happy.
Lilah (26:29)
Yes. Um, I had one at a bar in my neighborhood recently and had mezcal, ginger, beetroot, turmeric. I think it was really good, but so, yeah. So I'm on the beetroot kick, uh, right now. Um, I'm sure any historic person who I would invite to have a beetroot cocktail with me would be very confused and upset by it.
I would say, um, every time I think of like, who would want to have a dinner party with, I keep going back to family members. I think that I would love to meet, I never met my grandfather. He survived the Armenian genocide. He was like, went through, um, just a really crazy life. And so, um, I want to have a drink with him and maybe I’ll invite my mother to be nice. Why not?
Hanna (27:11)
Good choice. Good choice. As international travel resumes, what did your dream destination and why?
Lilah (27:20)
I mean, the one it's funny, I usually always want to go somewhere incredibly new or experience something I never have, but, uh, I'm really itching right now to go back to a few places I haven't been to in a long time.
Um, my father grew up in Thessaloniki, Greece, which is the second biggest city. There aren't as many tourists, which actually makes it even cooler. Um, it has some of the best food in Greece. Um, and, uh, it's sort of, it's on the port. It's like, uh, people are eating and drinking and smoking cigarettes on the waterfront and whatever living sort of, um, dramatic Greek lives.
And it just became the first UNESCO city of gastronomy and my family and I had been talking about how, how, how, how much we are salivating about, um, the food and can't wait to go back.
Michael (28:10)
You’re making us hungry.
Lilah (28:11)
Good.